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phantom phixer


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#6925 2015-08-28 13:25 GMT-5 hours    
Hello guys,

I took the liberty of starting a new thread so I can get some guidance on this new rejection trend I have stumbled across. I have had about a dozen pictures rejected in the last 30 days or so when before that I had never seen this rejection reason before. Although I did not appeal against any of these, the latest one in this string of rejections prompted me to start this thread. We can all benefit from the crew's answer to this. Unless I am the only one with this... illness

Please explain what is the "Subject too low" rejection rule? Are you counting pixels above the topmost end of the subject and below the lowest end of the subject and they have to be the same? Are we talking about a "center-weighted" kind of image? Please give us some clue so we won't waste your time with submissions that otherwise would have been easily fixed.



Please see above rejected image as an example.

Also this one here
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Photo © Kostas D. Pantios


Sometimes, if the subject isn't placed low on the frame, then you have a picture of a field or a flightline rather than a picture of an aircraft. There are aesthetic rules at play in our hobby. If you have to choose between having too much grass/tarmac or sky then we all go for the sky.

Finally, I'd like to take the opportunity and thank you all for your great work and for your help. Thanks for putting up with me

Kostas D. Pantios

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#6926 2015-08-29 06:54 GMT-5 hours    
Interesting theme Kostas, looking forward to the screeners replies ...

And please keep 'bothering' us with these nice pics from Greece

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#6927 2015-08-29 14:16 GMT-5 hours    
Hi Kostas,

That's exactly what it means, it's simply saying the aircraft is not centered vertically. Sometimes it can get too lopsided and it looks very uneven. The aircraft should be centered, especially when it's in the sky, on the ground sometimes it's not easy to do, but most often they are centered.

-Ray

This is the oldest I've ever been.

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phantom phixer


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#6928 2015-08-31 12:30 GMT-5 hours    
Hello Ray,

thanks for the reply.

You are not getting away that easy, I now feel more confused than before.

Although you didn't actually answer the questions, I won't linger with that. It is not my intention to drag you down to a "it is - it is not" kind of argument. But I will insist on the "it's supposed to be lower in the frame" kind of picture. Please bear with me.

We are taking pictures of aeroplanes i.e. pictures of long metal tubes with a flat thing sticking out on top of the tail. So our subject is inherently not balanced. Sticking to the centered subject rule (a rule only good if you are a 19th century family portrait photographer) , or to be more precise in our case here, the centered fuselage rule will produce some odd results.

Like for example this one here:

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Photo © Roberto Bianchi


Please, I don't mean to be rude, but this picture is wrong. I don't know of a more polite way to say this. You have 1/3 of the canvas empty. This is exactly the case where the subject is supposed to be low in the frame just to make it look more balanced.

The same goes for aircraft on the ground. Like I've said before, if you can choose between having the aircraft centered with an acre of grass/tarmac on the bottom of the frame then you have to tilt the camera up a bit so you have more sky than ground. After all it is aeroplanes we are shooting here. It's the same as with the rule where you are to leave a wee bit more space in front of the aircraft than in the back.

I will now knowingly exaggerate so that maybe I can bring my point across. See this picture here:

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Photo © Arie van Groen


Had the fuselage been just a little bit higher I would have reached the conclusion that whatever it was that the photographer was trying to shoot has left and all we are left with is a Hercules in the background.

The past month I've received 10 rejections 9 of which for the "subject too low" reason. Up until two months ago I've never seen this rejection reason before. And since all this time I've been posting pictures I've taken in 2011 only 3 days apart, I can tell it isn't something gone wrong with the way I take pictures all of the sudden. Right now maybe you are thinking you should have rejected the last 900 pictures or so and that you are sorry you didn't All I want to say is that this is a technical issue with the way this rule has been implemented.

Finally, the strict and unwavering implementation of this rule (and any other rule like for example the Contre-jour rule etc) in photography will only serve to reduce art and increase standardisation.

Please, I urge to reconsider.

Thanks for reading all this. It took me almost an hour typing with one finger like I do...

PS: Thanks Carl. I am glad you like the pictures. I have more Greek stuff coming up.

Kostas D. Pantios

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#6929 2015-08-31 23:48 GMT-5 hours    
Hi Kostas,

I just had a look at all your photos: http://www.airfighters.com/photosearch.php?phgid=674&lim=5&dis=thumbs Notice how beyond page 1, they were mostly balanced and in the middle. The last 100 or so you started getting unbalanced and thus, more rejections.

What do you think of this photo?

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Photo © Kostas D. Pantios


Would you say it's unbalanced with everything towards the bottom, or does it look nice and centered to you?

-Ray

This is the oldest I've ever been.

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#6932 2015-09-01 11:16 GMT-5 hours    
Hi Ray,

yes that's a bad photo on my behalf. I was very much surprised it got through. I shouldn't have sent it. You may delete it and fire the screener.

I see. I changed the way I shoot sometime in the afternoon of June 3rd, 2011. Thanks for pointing out.

Anyway, your site - your rules. I am sorry I have wasted your time.

Kostas D. Pantios

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#6938 2015-09-02 01:47 GMT-5 hours    
Hi Kostas,

No problem at all. No need to apologize. You certainly have a right to ask a question.

I just wish people, I'm not saying you Kostas, just people in general, wouldn't upload photos that would "surprise" them if it got accepted, because now, we just lowered the bar a little bit. You can bet that some photographer, someday, will use that photo and say "mine is same as this, then how come mine was rejected?".

-Ray

This is the oldest I've ever been.

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#6941 2015-09-02 16:52 GMT-5 hours    
Very good learning thread, and at least Kostas does not misuse the "shadows/highlight" tool This would be worth another thread looking at some recent 'bad weather' shots.
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